Internet Marketing For Small Business owners
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it’s nice to be doing this in dutch for once. so he’s on. i’m joined by saskia van ek-lammers. we’re talking in dutch because saskia is dutch and we thought itwould be practical to do it in dutch cause that would make things run smoother. i just explained it to saskia and i will also explain it to the people who’rewatching this now, and that is that recently we’re really trying to focus on the acquisitionprocess for entrepreneurs
entrepreneurs we help with our knowledge andthe tools we’re currently offering. en that’s what i want to do with saskia andwhat i also want to do is really look where we can improve our services to be morecomplementary to that which saskia is trying to achievewith her business. having said that i would like to start withsaskia. introduce yourself en tell us where you’re fromand how you ended up in the business you’re in and what you’re trying to achieve in thatbusiness as johan said, my name is saskia van ek,married, have 2 children en my profession is beautician.
so i’m not coming from the web design sideof things. i didn’t go to class for it, but i did do anintensive online marketing training 3 years ago, because in our company, because onthe side we run a big beauty salon, we needed to change. we needed to go online and our industry isjust…, we do our jobs the best way we can and we’re good in making people pretty andeverything surrounding that. but that doesn’t cover the online marketingpart because we don’t learn that. that bothered me so i went out myself andthat was the reason i created my own wordpress website.
i learned everything myself. until i thought, i need to do somethingwith this en there are a lot of colleagues who are having the same challenges i have. and i would like to help them. was that what you mean with “we neededto change� i assume you had a financial incentive, about things not happening from a financial standpoint. is that correct? yeah, we needed to change.
you’ve got customers. but you also know your business is changing or at least the way people search. back in the day it was the yellowpages. and that’s what made us big and throughword of mouth. but you realise that’s over at a certainpoint in time. that era. and based on the fact i run the businesswith my sister and parents, and my parents are old school, meaning yellow pages andcold calling and word of mouth
i just knew we had to move in anotherdirection. and of course we had a website. because we went along with it, but with thecurrent web designer that website cost us a fortune and it did nothing for us thinking about the training i had done. what did it cost, make it tangible? it was more than 5000 euros ($5600) and that was just a simple website, thatwasn’t even optimised, where at most i could only edit a piece of tekst andupload a photo and everything
i wanted to do because of the online marketing training i needed to pay for by the hour. and i received invoice after invoice. the changes i wanted based on the trainingwould cost me another 3000 ($3400) euros. and i know i’m very cheap now with theprices for websites i ask but i don’t really mind. my personal drive is that i teach people todo it themselves. that you can edit something yourself.
and that’s when i came across nexus themesbecause i just started googling and went looking for wordpress themes in the beautyindustry because i really want to create themes for my niche. because my heart is really in this beautyindustry. and that’s how i stumbled upon your beautifulthemes that offer everything, and where i don’t have to use any plugin because thefunctionality is all there. and i was very happy it was dutch. at least a dutch company because it was a bit frightening to just say: i’m going to buy some theme for a 100 dollarsin the u.s. not knowing if it’ll work.
yes or no. so i just… at first i got you on the phonejohan. i don’t know if you can remember that. it was a support question. i think i turned on the sales machine right there. for the studio solution. yeah, i think i did. i began the conversation with you to findout who i was dealing with. so you we’re dealing with all thattechnical shit.8200:05:49,120 --> 00:05:55,270and i was saying, you need to use our studio.
and it took a while because i remember hanging up and talking togert-jan and it took days before you… you needed time to let it sink inen i think you contacted us again afterwards. so there were a couple of moments beforeyou really started building websites. yeah, great, really great. then i thought, wow, and then i startedplaying with it and then i thought: yes, i need to do more with this to resellthis. because, like i said, i didn’t study for it,and i’m self taught.
what i really liked right at the start werethose support videos you made. i mean support on video. that you don’t have to read pages of textto build something, and that’s how i learned to work with themes from nexusthemes and how i started selling them. so in short that’s my story. so to speak. yeah i could go on for hours… i’m sureyou could. okã©, but of all the things you could do. you’re busy, you run a business.
the website part is just a small part of it alli assume? you’ve got a family going. how do you balance the online part withall of the other things? and where do you want to go, from whereyou are now? what would you like to see happening? well i would like to… look i’m a beautician anda real specialist. that’s going to be a big part of my professionalcareer. but meanwhile i found out, because i follow alot of marketing experts, that you… it’s like this old saying: treating people won’t get your rich
trading will. so that’s my starting point. my point on the horizon is with the help oflaloni, which is the name of my company create a passive income through web design. so i can do less treatments in the long run. because now i’m 35, but i have to start thinking about my retirement. and i don’t want to have some insurance. i want to do it myself. and that’s this… i can always do this.
whether i’m tired. you can always do this. the online part i mean. and online. i’ve got so many ideas because i’m so busy right now with the salonin which i pour a lot of my heart and time because i’m also a doer, i also realise thatit has to be quite easy if you can believe all the marketeers out there,it has to be very easy to create an income.
you guys have an awesome product as well. buildit, active a theme, customise it and sell it. that’s what i really like, but there’s that littlepiece you’re hinting at, how to sell it. and you have to stick with your industry. and you have to believe in yourself, that’smy little part. pick your niche. so that’s exactly what i did. that’s what i talked to gert-jan aboutmany times. where would you like to go?
do i want to sell websites to anybody? or do i want to stick with the branche i’mcurrently in? and that’s what i chose for. so i understand the passion of beauticians orhairdressers or nail stylists. and i understand there frustration of notbeing able to move ahead. and then it’s a great feeling of having somebodywho’s got your back, like you with me, when i’m dealing with something technical thatyou have a backup. and that’s what i want to learn. but i also really want to convert that onlinepart into a course.
i talked about that in the group… i talkedto dennis prins about that at a certain time. he was also a bit stuck, thinking about howto give support. but i just mimicked you. i also have a youtube channel. so all the questions i get from my clients iscreencast. so i make a video and people really like thatbecause they can pauze that video. it’s literally just copying.
giving a bit of background where you are withyour online initiatives you’ve built 10 plus websites for the people inthe industry you’re in. meaning the beauty niche. those are people who run nail studios, beauty salons etc. and i’ve got nutrition consultants, because i’m also one myself. those kind of things. actually that’s what i want… those arethe people i’m working with okã©, i’ve got 2 questions.
one: how do they get to you or how doyou get to them? and two: where in that process do youfeel lies your biggest challenge? first how they come to me. i work with a product myself which is calledpowerslim and is a weight loss solution. and i convinced the company behind powerslimof my vision in relation to being online. ok. how did you do that? was it on the phone, did you drop by? i talked to my account manager.
saying: hey listen, i know… you can see bylooking at my revenue what online means for me, so it has got to work for others as well. you’ve got a web shop where you sell that stuff? no, we don’t work with web shops but we dowork with getting found. so it’s very important that your website isfound on the internet and you share your knowledge. that’s just very important. that you’re able to show your authority. and i do that through blogging. so i blog a lot about beauty related subjects.
and then i talked to them about that and ishowed what i had built with laloni. and they we’re really hyped because they’realso very strong online and they believe that you have to make the connection onlineand with facebook. sure, because when their suppliers find ways toconnect to their clients it makes sure that they’ve found a means to sell moreproduct. yes, if you’re doing well, than we’re doing welland my clients are doing well. that’s how you’re able to make the connection. and do they know… because now you’ve builtthose 10 plus websites. what did your account manager have to sayabout that?
what was their reaction? because i assume you talked to them about it? great! and really good, working also from a technical perspective. we just discussed the landingspage. well they think that’s very important. so i’m going to work on that. i also teach how to make newsletters,mailchimp, sending… your clients you teach mailchimp?
you mean you teach your clients how touse mailchimp? not the supplier, powerslim. i’m not that far, but who knows? but i’m out there, so good things willhappen. but that’s another dot on the horizon. to make a great course so people in ourbranche can learn how to better market themselves. preferably online. that you build something once en enableyourself to sell it multiple times.
that you don’t have to be a bigshot butyou could do your thing on the couch drinking a cup of coffee. and i talked to them about that and myaccount manager is saying to me you need to call that person because shewants a website. and at this moment she’s also my accountmanager. i’ve got a number of things going. and beyond that i don’t do much. ok i’m thinking about something becauseyou’re doing this all alone i assume? yes.
is it possible that you go to that accountmanager? this is almost a rhetorical question andthat you say: hey listen up… oh, you’re connection is failing. look, i believe that being complementary…you’re doing this alone with your company and now you’ve planted the seed that youunderstand what being online means. you not only get it but you also went and didthose online courses and you learned wordpress to a certain extend and now the relationshiphas changed with your account manager. and you can step on the pedal there.
and how you do that is not by doing everythingyourself but that you say… you’re a kind of lead generator for the needin that beauty industry. you know that the need is there. that powerslim account manager has access toall those people and together you could spread the proposition of being online to all those people and there has to be a lot of them in the netherlands. yes they are many. am i talking about a hundred here or maybea lot more? i think that now there are about 350 pointsof sale in the netherlands.
ok, so there are 350 of them… you see, theother business just keeps on going. yeah sure, sure. yeah that’s ok. cut it, just cut it again. just cut it. snap! that’s going to go imagine of those 350. you can convert 1%.
or you’re doing well, because you’re authentic and you know your stuff. because you run such a joint yourself andyou convert 2%. 2% of 350. that’s 7 leads. you can’t service them in 1 month, becauseyou just don’t have the time. for 7 leads, for 7 websites. how long would it take you to finish them? 3 or 4 months? well i’m trying to… no it depends.
when they do a lot of copywriting themselves. because i’m no copywriter. they have to do that themselves. but i always try… when i take the time, i can finish thetask in 3 full days. you talk about… but yeah, i’m doing iton the side. so that would be… yeah, those are going to be some workdays,family and all. 3 weeks. yes. 3 weeks because i can do it 1 day aweek.
then my question is: what is necessary for it not only to be 1batch, but to become a sustainable business? that you go from 3 to 10 and then to 20because you proactively market yourself as wanting to be the online marketing expertfor this industry.. because after you’ve finished a website the jobisn’t finished, so you could service 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 100, all of these type ofclients. what would it take? what do you need to be able to be that kindof person?
and also be able to reap the financial rewards. let’s be clear on that for a moment. eh, well… what do i need for that? i think i’m going to work 2 days less inthe salon. yeah, then… it means you… yes, you have to make choicesyou know? ok, i think… just imagine… because wealso have beauty themes. imagine we help you.
it doesn’t matter how or what because we’retalking luxury problems here. those leads are rolling in. we’ll do what’s necessary to get thosesites live. the only think we ask is you do that in yourstudio, what you’re already doing and what you’re paying us for. i mean it means that there’s also somefinancial incentive for us and it’s a huge showcase for our company about howto deal with this way… funny thing is you’re the third person i’mtalking to who’s part of our group and who has this kind of directory-likestory.
about knowing a person, who knows personsin that niche, with the real small business owners in that niche. this is another… this is the third storyin a row with such a directory. and this is about a company that sellsstuff b2b. kacem said: oh sure, this is an absolutegold mine. he said in the group it’s a gold mine. it already gave me 10 leads. you’ve already got… you say your accountmanager effectively works for you. and i’m only talking about this little part. this is just one supplier.
and this weekend i went to a convention. the top of the iceberg gathers there. there are a lot of business owners that justdon’t know how to incorporate that piece. just now i built a website who simply worksso many hours in her salon she just forgets about this little piece. so i said, those are the words stuck in myhead, you shouldn’t only be working in your business, you also need to work on the business. even if you think you’re already busy enough. you can get stuck in a rut anytime.
i’m a person who wants to grow. i’m 35, i want… you need to be there. you don’t know where you need to start withonline and all the steps you need to learn, of technique, of wordpress, of themes, of plugins,of hosting, of domain registration. it took me 3 years. even if you could write down on a piece ofpaper all the knowledge you learned and you’d give it to your colleagues. maybe it wouldn’t take them 3 years. but itwill take them half a year, or a year.
there not waiting for that either. they don’t want that. they’d rather pay, that’s what you’resaying. they’d rather pay for a service, or a membership or something. i’ve thought about that. but i’m just afraid to sell, becausei simply don’t have the time. if somebody talks to me and says: hey, iwant to do this campagne, what price do you aks for that? yeah, what on earth do i need to… that’s…so that’s where your need is.
your need is… you’re a sales person. you know how to sell. you only can’t deliver what you sell. well it so happens we have access… we havethe knowledge and expertise to bridge the gap so to speak. yeah and i’ll say “we’ll find a wayâ€. “we’ll make it happenâ€. if we can see that with this supplier alone, with the things you’re already doing, meaning you build a website based on a certaintheme within a certain timeframe, that you
get all those leads and you can handle themby yourself. the only thing i would like to see is youpushing the pedal and proactively make this happen. stating: i’ve talked to my own supplierfrom the tool i’ve been using. en based on that conversation, if wereally want to, that we can make it happen. and are you willing, miss account manager, towork with us during a trial period and a number of leads, to see if this works out? for example, give me 5 or 10 at a time, andthen we’ll see how we’ll deal with it.
i think about exactly this. this is exactly what i’m looking for. and i think, but you have to answer that foryourself, that this is what you’re looking for. to make the shift from b2c in your salon with your clients, to moving on top b2b and looking for that piece of income. and this could be something on the sidefor the moment. if this is going to work it is a trueboost to your current revenue. and if it works you could really makethe shift. and if it works you’re not just going todo this with this supplier.
but you’re going to do it with all of theother people who’re also trying to sell stuff to all the beauty salons in the netherlands. and you’ll have the track record of thisinitiative to show. in your boot, i meant in the pocket. just look, i put 30 of them online here. your people still got zero. your products aren’t being sold at all. powerslim is. it is called powerslim right?
that’s what i got in my head. that’s what i’m thinking about based on theinterviews i’ve done with all the other people. you put it out there. a directory of people who’ve got the sameneeds. for you it means people in the beauty industrywho also want to harness the power of the online part. from there the leads come rolling in. well roll… they won’t just fall into yourlap of course.
no, you’re right there. but i think i can be authentic. there are few… that’s what i looked up. there are few website builders, who specificallytarget this niche. and they’re all women. and i don’t want to be rude to you guys, butyou don’t have a clue about this industry. you get me? of course there are a couple of malecolleagues.
that’s my conclusion every time. i’m with this guy and he starts of rambling about some technical stuff i don’t have a clue about. and me thinking: here we go again. that’s not what i want to hear. i want to know what a website is going to meanfor me, if i’ll show up in the search engines, if i get more clients. because that’s what we all want. we all want more clients with the help ofour website.
and that’s how i’m trying to sell it. you’ll never hear me talk about… and thatwas what’s so great about what was said in the facebook group by dahlian. he made it visible that it is possible torank in google within the hour. at a certain point he wrote: it just showsthat in terms of ranking web design isn’t the defining factor. you need to be able to sell it and almostbe able to state: here, look in one day you’ll have that number one spot. and then design doesn’t matter because theirclients don’t care about a beautiful
website in the first place. no that’s right and he said: “the results,the results, the resultsâ€. it’s not about a website. yeah and that’s just it in our industry. we want everything to be perfect. mijn colleagues are saying: yeah, but howdoes it look. and i say. that’s not the point. do your clients look at the design of yoursite or do they just want to know the prices? how much money a certain treatment is.
that’s a mindset shift. good luck achievingthat. i needed to make it myself. but i know it works. can you walk us through the process of suchan acquisition conversation? for example, your account manager says:saskia, here’s a phone number, you go talk to that person. how does that go? that’s what i learned from the sales conversations.listen first. listen where your clients challenges comefrom.
and than i ask questions about them. what are bottlenecks? why do you want anotherwebsite? that kind of questions. then i get answers to those and then i’llexplain what i do. and i always begin with my own story, that iknow firsthand from experience where the pain is. listen, i’ve been duped myself, just toput it blandly, with a very expensive website that didn’t get me nowhere. and then i explain where i am now.
so very quickly you get a very open conversationand 9 times out of 10 they say yes. and i started real low. at first i asked 30 euros to build a siteand at a certain moment i thought: that’s just too little. so right now i’m at 495 to 595 and that’sstill not expensive. but i realise they’re all small businessowners, alone, with a salon. and that’s quite a big chunk of money, ifyou need to spend it at once. dalian said, to circumvent that issue, youcan also use
spread payments. that works for him. so you pay half, and in the 6 months afterwardsyou pay… so that could also be an idea that could work for you. that’s indeed a great tip. and i’m getting faster all the time, sothat’s not what’s holding me back. and i trust support. people can always contact me with theirissues, the same way i can contact you guys.
i really like that. so i’m always using myself as a startingpoint. what do i like? what do i need? what do i want? and then you get a little supply and demandwhich you create. and that’s reflected in my pricing. so to focus on… and you probably alreadymentioned it. you want some passive income. who doesn’t? i can image, you being the type of person
who won’t stay still. but it’s just about a little more security and flexibility and breathing space for yourself and the things you want to spend your time on. instead of i have to go to the salon becausethat’s my only source of income. i think we’ve discussed exactly that whatwas necessary. or course i’m going to discuss this here. and i would like to propose to not just letthis be a nice conversation but to make it tangible as well. of course if that’s what you want as well.
this isn’t about nexus themes or anything. so i think that’s what we should do. that’s good. and i’m glad to hear everybody comes full circle. that most people work for small business ownerswhom they like to help online. there’s just no way back anymore. and you can downplay that. but in the end you need to do somethingwith your website. it’s not just about having a website andsaying: well i have a website
so that’s not it. and that’s what i’m trying to tell myclients. but i do have those dots on the horizon. very goo. you should. go do your thing. i believe you had to do something with oneof your kids at school. so that’s what’s most important. but we’ll keep in touch. ik hope other people will find the nuggetsfor themselves based on this conversation.
and if i’m correct we’re going to talk toeach other and make things happen. thanks very much johan for your invitation. and again, i’m super happy with you guys sothat’s not it. let’s wrap up with that. ok, have a nice day then.
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